[Proposal] Scale out ANC-UST Rewards

You’re a few hours early Nate: please wait until all the liquidity is 52-weeks locked into Astroport, then we can talk about scaling the rewards down xD

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The migration to Astro should be complete by the 28th. @ryanology045 can you confirm? If so we can get the discussion going now so that by the time the 28th hits we have vote approved and ready to go.

Are we talking about the rewards for LP staking only?

Yes, still need borrow emmision rewards and staking rewards.

Sorry, maybe a bit of an obvious question. But are we talking about ANC-UST LP not getting any ANC rewards at all, after a large portion of the LPs have been locked under Astroport?

Will they be getting only the lockdrop ASTRO rewards plus future Astro fees after the Astro Generator goes live? If this is the case, wouldn’t it be reasonable to have passed this before the lock, or after the 52 weeks? I would assume most users have no idea they were locking their LPs into a pool that might be cut the fees to 0 after they decided to lock. Plus, one of the core ideas of migrating LPs was to have dual rewards. The difference is now they will not be able to do anything about it (unstake and sell, for example). Sounds like a bit of a cheeky timing move.

Sorry if I got anything wrong. I’ll search for older threads on the topic as well.

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I like the proposal and will vote yes :raised_hands:

The dual rewards are not for 52 weeks. They were slated to be from Dec 28th + ~2/3 weeks to ensure proper time for complete migration. Therefore, the date of Jan 28th would be sufficient time to make sure everyone that locked gets the duel rewards for the duration of it. From there they will get the lock drop Astro. The idea is to remove the Anchor side LP rewards since they have no purpose now as all AMM will be run through Astro before Jan 28th. Hope this helps.

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The whole idea of migrating to Astroport was to allow Anchor to lower/cut LP emissions, and let Astroport pay the bill of sorts, this was the major idea behind the migration for most protocols afaik. Locking was an Astroport mechanism/contract and should have never been assumed to be an ongoing compromise between both parties, it’s also probably relevant that Astro governance will also be able to adjust LP rewards before the 52 weeks end.

(I’m saying this and I locked most of my LP positions on Astro for the full duration)

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hello👋 please to clarify:

Astro phase1 dual rewards not scheduled for release until Nov2022(52wks)…but ANC-LP rewards will end Jan2020(4wks)?

Agreed, it makes sense hence why we are working with Astro.

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Correct, dual rewards are slated to end ~ 2-3 weeks after Dec 28th. But this all depends on a community vote, thus the posting here. No promise was ever made on how long ANC-UST LP would last even before Astro, with many community members proposing ending LP rewards several months ago.

Thanks! It’s clear now. Appreciate it.

I think it’s bullshit to eliminate the awards with no notice. In fact, it reeks of whale insider trading.

ANC’s emission schedule (50m tokens of max LP incentives in Year 1 & 50m tokens max in Year 2) was the most recent signal to the public about our intentions.

Anybody would know that overall LP emissions would go down significantly after March as we shift into Year 2 emissions, and ANC emissions per dollar would go down significantly because we’ve seen so much deposit growth.

But if we want to talk about reducing emissions (a goal that most of us share here), there are definitely more honest ways to do it. For example, why are we pulling in so many deposits from Degenbox when when there isn’t even any demand for loans? Or is that another TFL-ANC related party transaction, because TFL is raising big external money right now and wants UST to be as richly valued as possible?

Eliminating ANC emissions 3 days into Astroport Phase 2 is basically a rugpull for ASTRO depositors who didn’t have the inside loop, who trusted us to not make drastic, sketchy changes the second ANC LPs locked their capital up with Astroport.

I suspected something like this would happen, which was why I didn’t lock my ANC up in ASTRO beyond Year 1 (3/15). But I’m still shocked at how brazenly some people here want to go back on ANC’s word.

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I appreciate your thoughts on this.

So would you propose scaling back rewards over a longer time?

There really is no purpose for them if Astro is providing all the liquidity, it just adds further ANC emissions. There have been many talks on these forums about cutting off the LP rewards so was not meant to be out of the blue.

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I really don’t see it the same way, anyone deciding to lock on Astro because of double rewards should have been involved in the discussion and vote for moving the liquidity incentives there, and that discussion included this exact point. Anyone that didn’t care to be involved and decided to lock, should blame no one but themselves, we can work out a better schedule but this needs to happen, emissions are far larger than they need to be.

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I was here for those discussions.

“Reduce rewards” and “eliminate rewards” are two very different things.

It was obvious, predictable, and sensible that ANC LP rewards would be reduced.

Not eliminated.

It is equally obvious that if you knew–or had a strong inkling–that that change was coming beforehand, you’d have much less incentive to stake the ASTRO ANC-UST LP pool, because you’d know that the value of ANC tokens would go up significantly as a result of drastically reduced emissions.

Not cool.

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Yeah there was no guarantee that there would be dual rewards and the community seemed pretty unanimous in its decision to not want any at all. It’s probably best to consider what is best for ANC gov stakers, not Astro LP holders.

I’m on the side of removing all emissions for LP providers and I did lock for the max amount of time, for the APOLLO rewards. I understand that if you believed otherwise and dual rewards were the reason why you locked, that it could be frustrating, but the discussion did hint at removing completely.

@bitn8
Sorry, this is bullshit.
If you want to zero ANC emissions, you vote on it BEFORE the Astroport launch, not after. The ANC community is much bigger than ANC stakers.

@paletas
I agree that ANC LP emissions are too high, by a big margin, and I even said so in that discussion. I don’t think it’s fair to ANC whales to dilute themselves to that extent.

But going from 120% ANC APY to 0% is not a significant reduction. It’s a 180 degree rugging. If you / the ANC big boys wanted to zero ANC emissions in a transparent, pro-community way, you’d vote on it BEFORE co-sponsoring the Astroport launch. Was the point of the “110% APY” to sucker little guys’ liquidity into Astroport, get them to lock up for the max, and then zero their APY (when you already take .1% of the Astro .3% for yourselves, assuming you’re an ASTRO whale now thanks to Anchor little guys’ LP liquidity that you sold to Astroport, cuz yeah I read the Astroport docs too)?

Not only is this shortsighted, it’s just dishonest. Crypto communities subsidize their little guys to get good marketing vibes and good word of mouth. Now you turn around and rug the sh*t out of them because they don’t have the time to follow every debate in this normally very sleepy forum?

This is a rugging by another name and both of you know it.

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I’m in agreement that reducing lp rewards to zero in such a short time is drastic, especially doing so right after some folks have locked their lp with Astroport for an entire year (in crypto time, that’s close to forever). Even the sudden increase to lp rewards right before the Astro lockdrop surprised me. If there was an inkling to reduce rewards further down the line, this increase is inconsistent with that intent. I do agree in a gradual, controlled reduction to the lp rewards, that should be guided by discussion here. But anything drastic, could reasonably be viewed as a rug pull, if not at least disingenuous.

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